Aaron Rodgers. Special teams. Deebo Samuel. Last weekend was the Green Bay Packers' absolute worst nightmare. We dissect it all on this two-hour podcast.
Great work. One big takeaway from this is that in their mission to appease Rogers and thus try to keep the locker room less toxic throughout the year, the Packers made some questionable personnel decisions, putting the older guys with strong voices and weaker legs onto the field when maybe a less popular decision could have built a stronger 53. A-Rod's insistence might have pushed Gutes to pick up Butler and Mercilus during the year, but when it comes to the playoffs, they should have been sensible rather than sentimental. Bob observed that Sullivan would have been a better play than Jaire in the cold against a run-heavy team. If they waited this long to activate, why not wait another week? I think keeping the high-powered players happy had to be one of the reasons.
I like that Ty pushed Bob for a QB prediction and Bob met it with a resounding 'no'. Both Ty and Bob are very complimentary of one another and should be, but during the podcast, Bob generally sticks to his guns. He observes, writes and speaks on what he sees in the moment and the past, not the mustard belches hovering in the air of the future. How much journalism now is about what we wonder will happen but never does? It says a lot about how we live. It's tasty but doesn't fill the stomach. So in the rare moments when Bob does offer to be the oracle, it means something.
It's funny that A-Rod comes across as this new age guy so in tune with himself, the grand meditator and reader, the man in the moment. Another reader had said that A-Rod was likely going over his post-game interview on the sidelines when the Pack was on defense. I think that's pretty close to the truth. He's writing the events of his biography before he's lived them. Strangely, it's almost as if he's the ghost writer for his own biography written by the networks. As Bob said, something is off with this guy, off and on the field.
Certainly Pack brass isn't going to bad mouth him: value goes down and they risk upsetting too many people, fans and players alike. Do Gutes and MLF want him gone? Of course they do. Who wants to continue kissing someone's ass like this, especially when the guy can't win in the playoffs? It will be nut-cutting time for Gutes if the opportunity arrives. Take out the shears Gutes!
So everyone, what do you think we get from Denver? 2022 1st and 2nd and swap of 3rd and GB's 4th, Jeudy or Risner and a 2023 2nd and 4th?
Finally, Bob wisely deferred a future podcast. But he is good at this, really good. I think his draft preview works well in both formats. And here are some ideas:
Superbowl Podcast w McGinn memory
Draft Podcast 1: offensive players and McGinn memory
Draft Podcast 2: defensive players and McGinn memory
Written: All the usual good stuff and a first round mock draft alongside Monos and Ty's?:)
Draft Podcast 3: Draft wrap up and McGinn memory
This was just a great part of my week this year. Thank you both.
Jake, great post, one of the best I've read here. I think you HAVE to get Jaire on the field, he's one of the best DBs in the league! Let's face it, the thought was that we were going to win this game, it would be tough but the Packers would be in the NFC CHampionship. And they would absolutely need a good Jaire vs. the Rams/Bucs and Chiefs/Bills to win it all That was their mindset. So giving him 8 plays vs. SF was key to getting him back at full strength down the road. They had to activate him. They just had to hope some key running play didnt come down to him making the tackle. What were the odds of that anyway? :( Unfortunatey it DID happen.
We're all splitting up on Arod like like when they moved on from Favre to Rodgers. It was 50/50 in Packerland. Now we have fans who love him, or point out that they are regular season winners year after year and folks who maybe don't dig into the detailed analysis and know that he had big responsibility for many of the playoff losses. They just look at 20/29 for 200+ yards and think he had a good game. To him he's a god and if you lose 22 of the 24 free agents because you have to pay him $47M, so be it, they think the Packers will be great and in the SB hunt again next year anyway (they're wrong IMO).
THEN you have the fans who have maybe dug into it a little, listen to this podcast and others and realize how Rodgers has basically choked in the playoffs many years and also have some knowledge of the salary cap situation knowing we could probably keep 6 more players on that FA list if we cut Rodgers loose and those fans want to move on. A better path forward, albeit a risky one with the unknown Love.
I have no idea what we'd get from Denver. Two 1st rounders is probably unrealistic. 1st and 2nd and some other stuff seems reasonable. On another Podcast, Mike Wahle said it would be nuts for Rodgers to go to Denver, they don't have a SB caliber team even with him. AND, something I probably didn't fully realize until this past weekend, there are WAY MORE top young QBs in the AFC, there are like 5 or 6 of them. The Path to the SB is WAY harder for Rodgers in the AFC. Given the way he thinks, he has to be weighing this heavily in his decision. So now I think his going to Denver is a lower probability.
I was surprised at MLF and Gutey's fawning over Rodgers in the past week: i.e. Of course we want you back, we'll do anything.... But you are right, they have to say this, they have to keep his value up, they have to keep all fans happy, no matter what they think inside. I believe they probably do want to move on. THE BIG QUESTION: What do they think of Love? They see him every day and probably have formed a solid opinion. So, do they think he is likely to be an ave. starter but they can build a SB team around him? Do they think he'll be an above ave. starter? Do they think he has a chance to be great? Who knows? Love has shown us nothing in 2 games but they should have a pretty good idea by now. This will clearly influence everything. If they think Love is really not the guy, they may hang onto Rodgers for another 2-3 years, even if it decimates the roster. They know this will likely not result in a SB team but will result in a WINNING team for another 3 years, probably a playoff team and therefore they'll keep their jobs. So it may come down to if they want to play it safe or if they really want to go for it and go for winning a SB even at the risk of losing their jobs (all or nothing mentality). We shall see.
I do think for the Packers its probably the best thing to move on.
All week I have wondered what happened to the Packers last Saturday. I found out (again) that there’s a lot of talk out there but little insight. With Bob, however, I finally found someone who could cut through the clutter.
Almost forgot...I'm a fan of both of you from your podcast days with the MJS, and Bob from forever. Ty, I know you have to give our hero his latitude, but I wonder if you can coax him into adding his draft day mock back in to cap off his draft series. Since it's Bob, I'm sure he hates them but his explanations with all those sources always shed a light about what teams around the league-and especially the Packers-are thinking on draft day. Or at least what the should be thinking. It's really nowhere else. He nailed the Kenny Clark pick, the Kenny King pick and said the Pack would be interested in Rashaan Gary but expected he'd be gone, so he went with Simmons. That's not the kind of hot take garbage you get from anyone else's mock. A class by itself. Thanks again.
Christl's orneriness was fun. I remember him doing a Packer chat on MJS site that went something like:
Reader: Why would you ever spend a high draft pick on a running back when it seems they can be found anywhere, even in free agency. They've found a great running back in Samkon Gado and now they're set.
Christl: I wouldn't put Samkon Gado in Canton just yet.
Good one. Yep, Samkon was the savior at RB...for about a year. I dont remember who replaced him or why.
Do you know that Cliff Christl is now the official GB Packers historian? I haven't followed him but I think he answers fans' questions about Packers history on their website. And I think he just wrote a book. I think he came out of retirement as a sportswriter to take that job.
Man, if there was ever a beat writer harsher on the Packers than Bob, it was Cliff Christl. I loved them both and I have followed Bob religiously since the MJS days, but Cliff was definitely a shade too harsh and Bob and his grades were always a half shade too harsh. But he's got the best insight and analysis. I listen to others and between them all get a pretty good balance of perspective.
I've listened and now need to go back to the recording and watch Alexander get blown up. And watch the missed blocks closer, etc.
Tyler thank you for getting Bob to keep doing this. Watching Packer football isn't complete without his assessments. It's just not. And you pushing him to make a prediction here and there when he clearly doesn't want to is also appreciated. And pushing him to continue the occasional podcast over the offseason was amusing. Clearly doesn't want to do that either. Ha.
I remember him saying after Favre's last game that the Packers would have to seriously think about what to do about him moving forward. I think you extracted a similar view from him at the end of this podcast while he still was able to avoid a prediction. Thanks again.
Bob won't say it, but his comments (always a bit on the harsh side) CLEARLY indicate he thinks they should and will move on from Rodgers. It's not just his poor play but it's his Cutler-like demeanor and attitude, You can tell it grates on Bob.
I probably shouldn't have used him as an example but that's what popped into my mind when I wrote my comment. But Bob always harps on Rodger's demeanor, hands in the fanny pack, just looks down and not fired up. Maybe that's unfair. Some people may just say he's calm. But I think he has a point, Rodgers doesn't rally others in a game like this. They were stuck in the doldrums.
Bob I will from this day forward insert "nut-cutti'n time" into my lexicon! And, you're right "there IS something wrong with this player!" No heart! Brett throws six picks vs. St. Louis and says "my only regret is I didn't have time to bring us back and throw 1 more for the record!" Always the competitor, unlike 12 who only cares about his passer rating.
Bob, Absolutely fantastic assessment. Greatly appreciate your time, effort, and willingness to share your insights! What a fresh perspective you bring with your assessment. Nothing close to this assessment from anyone else in the media! Always thought in the 70's and 80's one of the reasons the Pack would never tank, the sports writers and printed newspaper that was read by everyone in WI, held the Packers players, coaches, and management accountable. Poor play and the breakdown of the failures or weaknesses should be clearly articulated for everyone to see.
Then more digging, questions, and dialog about poor decisions made. Insights from players, coaches, and management in days, months, or off-season give insights into mistakes being owned, not tolerated, and who is held accountable and how.
It has been an absolute pleasure listening to you this fall - THANK YOU! My hope is you are willing to do this again next year. Your assessments are one of the highlights of the entire NFL season! GO PACK!
Thank you Ty and Bob. It was a fun year up to this game. After hearing Bob’s analysis I’m going to watch it again to wallow in my misery.
One thing is certain - I will stay subscribed to Go Long podcast! This is so valuable to me. Now that Green Bay and Buffalo are out, I assume you will continue your coverage to the bitter end.
As with every year it will be good to take some time off in hopes that the fire in the belly will be ignited again for Packers Football.
It would be so cool if you guys could be online live during the game. I would definitely mute the network talking heads to listen to Go Long LIVE!
Thanks Ty and Bob for putting this painful loss in perspective. I've loved the podcast all year. It is full of insight and honesty that is hard to find.
The special team perspective was awesome. Truly unique. I hope you guys will be back doing this again next year.
OK, I finally had a chance to watch that last 3rd and 7 run by the 49ers at the end of the game, that allowed them to run out the clock and also get a closer FG. Bob kind of said that Gary and ZaDarius were out of the play, kind of absolving them of guilt and laid it 100% in Jaire Alexander who "passed" on the tackle. Somewhat true but not exactly, Gary rushed up field, kind of like the play 5 minute earlier when he stopped a 4th and 1 play. So yes, he took himself out of the play where it happened to have been run, but he made very good effort, the ball just didn't go his way.
However, I consider Za-Darius Smith primarily responsible for this run. EGAD, he mysteriously cut inside as the ball is snapped, abandoning his Left End position. The huge hole that Deebo ran through was not caused by great blocking, it was caused by Za-Darius leaving his position intentionally. Then as the ball came right to his abandoned spot, he couldn't get back, looked like he was hung up on an arm block and also slightly slipping.
Yes, Jaire is the 2nd player responsible for this 1st down. I wouldn't say he "passed" on the tackle. That really isn't fair. He twitched outside, which was understandable, more room there, but then as Deebo ran to his inside, he struggled to get back; he threw himself at Deebo and yes, it was a weak attempt that didn't do anything to even slow Deebo down. All he had to do was slow him down, not tackle him. But he did neither. I wouldn't say he passed on the tackle, I'd say he got faked out.
I finally listened to this podcast and thought it was awesome. Thank you Bob and Tyler for telling like it is. GB needs to make some changes and soon. I’m hoping Rodgers gets traded to Denver and Gutey picks up a ST stud or a couple of good core players as a good start.
In spite of ALL the shortcomings Bob elucidates, the Packers could have still very easily won the game. I agree with the increasing impossibly of playing defense in the NFL. Most of the player protection changes are probably a good idea, but maybe some tilts back to the defense should be considered. Maybe let the DBs be more physical down the field.
My understanding was the Rizzi's wife didn't want to come to GB, and that was the real reason.
Bye the way, given the criticism of playing injured players just back, would you have not played them at all during the playoffs?
Great work. One big takeaway from this is that in their mission to appease Rogers and thus try to keep the locker room less toxic throughout the year, the Packers made some questionable personnel decisions, putting the older guys with strong voices and weaker legs onto the field when maybe a less popular decision could have built a stronger 53. A-Rod's insistence might have pushed Gutes to pick up Butler and Mercilus during the year, but when it comes to the playoffs, they should have been sensible rather than sentimental. Bob observed that Sullivan would have been a better play than Jaire in the cold against a run-heavy team. If they waited this long to activate, why not wait another week? I think keeping the high-powered players happy had to be one of the reasons.
I like that Ty pushed Bob for a QB prediction and Bob met it with a resounding 'no'. Both Ty and Bob are very complimentary of one another and should be, but during the podcast, Bob generally sticks to his guns. He observes, writes and speaks on what he sees in the moment and the past, not the mustard belches hovering in the air of the future. How much journalism now is about what we wonder will happen but never does? It says a lot about how we live. It's tasty but doesn't fill the stomach. So in the rare moments when Bob does offer to be the oracle, it means something.
It's funny that A-Rod comes across as this new age guy so in tune with himself, the grand meditator and reader, the man in the moment. Another reader had said that A-Rod was likely going over his post-game interview on the sidelines when the Pack was on defense. I think that's pretty close to the truth. He's writing the events of his biography before he's lived them. Strangely, it's almost as if he's the ghost writer for his own biography written by the networks. As Bob said, something is off with this guy, off and on the field.
Certainly Pack brass isn't going to bad mouth him: value goes down and they risk upsetting too many people, fans and players alike. Do Gutes and MLF want him gone? Of course they do. Who wants to continue kissing someone's ass like this, especially when the guy can't win in the playoffs? It will be nut-cutting time for Gutes if the opportunity arrives. Take out the shears Gutes!
So everyone, what do you think we get from Denver? 2022 1st and 2nd and swap of 3rd and GB's 4th, Jeudy or Risner and a 2023 2nd and 4th?
Finally, Bob wisely deferred a future podcast. But he is good at this, really good. I think his draft preview works well in both formats. And here are some ideas:
Superbowl Podcast w McGinn memory
Draft Podcast 1: offensive players and McGinn memory
Draft Podcast 2: defensive players and McGinn memory
Written: All the usual good stuff and a first round mock draft alongside Monos and Ty's?:)
Draft Podcast 3: Draft wrap up and McGinn memory
This was just a great part of my week this year. Thank you both.
Jake, great post, one of the best I've read here. I think you HAVE to get Jaire on the field, he's one of the best DBs in the league! Let's face it, the thought was that we were going to win this game, it would be tough but the Packers would be in the NFC CHampionship. And they would absolutely need a good Jaire vs. the Rams/Bucs and Chiefs/Bills to win it all That was their mindset. So giving him 8 plays vs. SF was key to getting him back at full strength down the road. They had to activate him. They just had to hope some key running play didnt come down to him making the tackle. What were the odds of that anyway? :( Unfortunatey it DID happen.
We're all splitting up on Arod like like when they moved on from Favre to Rodgers. It was 50/50 in Packerland. Now we have fans who love him, or point out that they are regular season winners year after year and folks who maybe don't dig into the detailed analysis and know that he had big responsibility for many of the playoff losses. They just look at 20/29 for 200+ yards and think he had a good game. To him he's a god and if you lose 22 of the 24 free agents because you have to pay him $47M, so be it, they think the Packers will be great and in the SB hunt again next year anyway (they're wrong IMO).
THEN you have the fans who have maybe dug into it a little, listen to this podcast and others and realize how Rodgers has basically choked in the playoffs many years and also have some knowledge of the salary cap situation knowing we could probably keep 6 more players on that FA list if we cut Rodgers loose and those fans want to move on. A better path forward, albeit a risky one with the unknown Love.
I have no idea what we'd get from Denver. Two 1st rounders is probably unrealistic. 1st and 2nd and some other stuff seems reasonable. On another Podcast, Mike Wahle said it would be nuts for Rodgers to go to Denver, they don't have a SB caliber team even with him. AND, something I probably didn't fully realize until this past weekend, there are WAY MORE top young QBs in the AFC, there are like 5 or 6 of them. The Path to the SB is WAY harder for Rodgers in the AFC. Given the way he thinks, he has to be weighing this heavily in his decision. So now I think his going to Denver is a lower probability.
I was surprised at MLF and Gutey's fawning over Rodgers in the past week: i.e. Of course we want you back, we'll do anything.... But you are right, they have to say this, they have to keep his value up, they have to keep all fans happy, no matter what they think inside. I believe they probably do want to move on. THE BIG QUESTION: What do they think of Love? They see him every day and probably have formed a solid opinion. So, do they think he is likely to be an ave. starter but they can build a SB team around him? Do they think he'll be an above ave. starter? Do they think he has a chance to be great? Who knows? Love has shown us nothing in 2 games but they should have a pretty good idea by now. This will clearly influence everything. If they think Love is really not the guy, they may hang onto Rodgers for another 2-3 years, even if it decimates the roster. They know this will likely not result in a SB team but will result in a WINNING team for another 3 years, probably a playoff team and therefore they'll keep their jobs. So it may come down to if they want to play it safe or if they really want to go for it and go for winning a SB even at the risk of losing their jobs (all or nothing mentality). We shall see.
I do think for the Packers its probably the best thing to move on.
All week I have wondered what happened to the Packers last Saturday. I found out (again) that there’s a lot of talk out there but little insight. With Bob, however, I finally found someone who could cut through the clutter.
Thank you, Bob, for pointing out things like:
* Alexander’s missed tackle.
* Why the field goal was blocked.
* The problem with some of last week’s cuts
* Rogers’ poor play
* etc, etc., etc.
This is why Go Long is worth the price!
Almost forgot...I'm a fan of both of you from your podcast days with the MJS, and Bob from forever. Ty, I know you have to give our hero his latitude, but I wonder if you can coax him into adding his draft day mock back in to cap off his draft series. Since it's Bob, I'm sure he hates them but his explanations with all those sources always shed a light about what teams around the league-and especially the Packers-are thinking on draft day. Or at least what the should be thinking. It's really nowhere else. He nailed the Kenny Clark pick, the Kenny King pick and said the Pack would be interested in Rashaan Gary but expected he'd be gone, so he went with Simmons. That's not the kind of hot take garbage you get from anyone else's mock. A class by itself. Thanks again.
From forever, Bob McGinn & Cliff Christl, but Cliff's not here
Christl's orneriness was fun. I remember him doing a Packer chat on MJS site that went something like:
Reader: Why would you ever spend a high draft pick on a running back when it seems they can be found anywhere, even in free agency. They've found a great running back in Samkon Gado and now they're set.
Christl: I wouldn't put Samkon Gado in Canton just yet.
Good one. Yep, Samkon was the savior at RB...for about a year. I dont remember who replaced him or why.
Do you know that Cliff Christl is now the official GB Packers historian? I haven't followed him but I think he answers fans' questions about Packers history on their website. And I think he just wrote a book. I think he came out of retirement as a sportswriter to take that job.
Man, if there was ever a beat writer harsher on the Packers than Bob, it was Cliff Christl. I loved them both and I have followed Bob religiously since the MJS days, but Cliff was definitely a shade too harsh and Bob and his grades were always a half shade too harsh. But he's got the best insight and analysis. I listen to others and between them all get a pretty good balance of perspective.
I've listened and now need to go back to the recording and watch Alexander get blown up. And watch the missed blocks closer, etc.
Tyler thank you for getting Bob to keep doing this. Watching Packer football isn't complete without his assessments. It's just not. And you pushing him to make a prediction here and there when he clearly doesn't want to is also appreciated. And pushing him to continue the occasional podcast over the offseason was amusing. Clearly doesn't want to do that either. Ha.
I remember him saying after Favre's last game that the Packers would have to seriously think about what to do about him moving forward. I think you extracted a similar view from him at the end of this podcast while he still was able to avoid a prediction. Thanks again.
Bob won't say it, but his comments (always a bit on the harsh side) CLEARLY indicate he thinks they should and will move on from Rodgers. It's not just his poor play but it's his Cutler-like demeanor and attitude, You can tell it grates on Bob.
Cutler demeanor. I hadn’t thought of it that way but probably accurate. Brutal.
I probably shouldn't have used him as an example but that's what popped into my mind when I wrote my comment. But Bob always harps on Rodger's demeanor, hands in the fanny pack, just looks down and not fired up. Maybe that's unfair. Some people may just say he's calm. But I think he has a point, Rodgers doesn't rally others in a game like this. They were stuck in the doldrums.
Just fantastic. I will probably listen to it multiple times.
Bob I will from this day forward insert "nut-cutti'n time" into my lexicon! And, you're right "there IS something wrong with this player!" No heart! Brett throws six picks vs. St. Louis and says "my only regret is I didn't have time to bring us back and throw 1 more for the record!" Always the competitor, unlike 12 who only cares about his passer rating.
Bob, Absolutely fantastic assessment. Greatly appreciate your time, effort, and willingness to share your insights! What a fresh perspective you bring with your assessment. Nothing close to this assessment from anyone else in the media! Always thought in the 70's and 80's one of the reasons the Pack would never tank, the sports writers and printed newspaper that was read by everyone in WI, held the Packers players, coaches, and management accountable. Poor play and the breakdown of the failures or weaknesses should be clearly articulated for everyone to see.
Then more digging, questions, and dialog about poor decisions made. Insights from players, coaches, and management in days, months, or off-season give insights into mistakes being owned, not tolerated, and who is held accountable and how.
It has been an absolute pleasure listening to you this fall - THANK YOU! My hope is you are willing to do this again next year. Your assessments are one of the highlights of the entire NFL season! GO PACK!
Amazing breakdown Ty and Bob, love the memories. Keep up the great work!
Thank you Ty and Bob. It was a fun year up to this game. After hearing Bob’s analysis I’m going to watch it again to wallow in my misery.
One thing is certain - I will stay subscribed to Go Long podcast! This is so valuable to me. Now that Green Bay and Buffalo are out, I assume you will continue your coverage to the bitter end.
As with every year it will be good to take some time off in hopes that the fire in the belly will be ignited again for Packers Football.
It would be so cool if you guys could be online live during the game. I would definitely mute the network talking heads to listen to Go Long LIVE!
Thank you, Tyler, Jim, and Bob!
Just thought of the problem with going live. Which games would you pick? It would still be fun, though!
Thanks Ty and Bob for putting this painful loss in perspective. I've loved the podcast all year. It is full of insight and honesty that is hard to find.
The special team perspective was awesome. Truly unique. I hope you guys will be back doing this again next year.
OK, I finally had a chance to watch that last 3rd and 7 run by the 49ers at the end of the game, that allowed them to run out the clock and also get a closer FG. Bob kind of said that Gary and ZaDarius were out of the play, kind of absolving them of guilt and laid it 100% in Jaire Alexander who "passed" on the tackle. Somewhat true but not exactly, Gary rushed up field, kind of like the play 5 minute earlier when he stopped a 4th and 1 play. So yes, he took himself out of the play where it happened to have been run, but he made very good effort, the ball just didn't go his way.
However, I consider Za-Darius Smith primarily responsible for this run. EGAD, he mysteriously cut inside as the ball is snapped, abandoning his Left End position. The huge hole that Deebo ran through was not caused by great blocking, it was caused by Za-Darius leaving his position intentionally. Then as the ball came right to his abandoned spot, he couldn't get back, looked like he was hung up on an arm block and also slightly slipping.
Yes, Jaire is the 2nd player responsible for this 1st down. I wouldn't say he "passed" on the tackle. That really isn't fair. He twitched outside, which was understandable, more room there, but then as Deebo ran to his inside, he struggled to get back; he threw himself at Deebo and yes, it was a weak attempt that didn't do anything to even slow Deebo down. All he had to do was slow him down, not tackle him. But he did neither. I wouldn't say he passed on the tackle, I'd say he got faked out.
I finally listened to this podcast and thought it was awesome. Thank you Bob and Tyler for telling like it is. GB needs to make some changes and soon. I’m hoping Rodgers gets traded to Denver and Gutey picks up a ST stud or a couple of good core players as a good start.
Good thing the Packers signed Billy Lyon and suited him up lol
In spite of ALL the shortcomings Bob elucidates, the Packers could have still very easily won the game. I agree with the increasing impossibly of playing defense in the NFL. Most of the player protection changes are probably a good idea, but maybe some tilts back to the defense should be considered. Maybe let the DBs be more physical down the field.
My understanding was the Rizzi's wife didn't want to come to GB, and that was the real reason.
Bye the way, given the criticism of playing injured players just back, would you have not played them at all during the playoffs?
Lombardi's wife didn't want to come to Green Bay either. And we saw how that turned out!
And thanks to Jim Monos for the new nickname for the star: "Mr Ten Points". Good Wisconsin name.
Outstanding analysis, and much-needed after that final game. The discussion of special teams was top-notch. Great great stuff.